tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post1395353607864264263..comments2024-03-27T03:00:27.024-04:00Comments on Facts & other stubborn things: Further thoughts on Mises and the line "you are inferior"Evanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12259004160963531720noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-35953297443163036202013-03-20T07:22:07.050-04:002013-03-20T07:22:07.050-04:00That's a fair complaint about the age of slave...That's a fair complaint about the age of slavery, but it says nothing about the modern age.Currenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645195276844244481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-51757533205989365992013-03-20T07:15:15.221-04:002013-03-20T07:15:15.221-04:00To begin with that's an huge mangling of the h...To begin with that's an huge mangling of the history of personal computing. Microsoft did not buy CPM from IBM, IBM didn't even own CPM.<br /><br />Secondly, operating systems are an unusual case. An OS become popular in large part because of the set of applications written for it. It's not a product that stands and falls on it's own.<br /><br />But, most products and services aren't like that. Yet, in most pioneering market sectors we don't see huge numbers of businesses that push profit rates down quickly.Currenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645195276844244481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-17818962049815918342013-03-18T06:20:03.743-04:002013-03-18T06:20:03.743-04:00DK,
You're responding to the tone of Mises wh...DK,<br /><br />You're responding to the tone of Mises which puts you near the bottom of Paul Graham's Disagreement Hierarchy. Work harder.<br /><br />http://www.acceleratingfuture.com/michael/blog/images/disagreement-hierarchy.jpgbackyardfoundrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-83431415500252532562013-03-18T06:11:24.249-04:002013-03-18T06:11:24.249-04:00Daniel
Where is the line between Mises and Nixon?...Daniel<br /><br />Where is the line between Mises and Nixon?<br /><br />http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21768668<br /><br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-86097488000666773142013-03-17T15:51:04.188-04:002013-03-17T15:51:04.188-04:00Shorter Mises, shorter Rand:
"The poor man i...Shorter Mises, shorter Rand:<br /><br />"The poor man is the DEVIL!"<br /><br />We might go on to observe that, prior to Frederick Douglass, there were very few slaves in America who made much of an individual contribution. So, clearly, slaveholders had picked the right people to be slaves -- they were obviously inferior people who had nothing better than hard labor to contribute.<br /><br />Blech. Willhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14943136764424893492noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-76168429667295807092013-03-17T13:36:09.699-04:002013-03-17T13:36:09.699-04:00"Social Determinists may say that if Napolean..."Social Determinists may say that if Napolean (for example) hadn't being born then someone else would have served in his place and history would have been similar. That argument is very difficult to make in modern market economies though. We live in a world where very many people can start businesses in their garages, and many do. Only a few of them succeed though."<br /><br />I do not subscribe to that theory, but I would have thought that modern market economies would support the idea, because it facilitates competition. In almost all races, the second best is almost as good as the first, and is similar in a number of ways besides performance. Switching winners is not likely to make much of a broad difference. If Microsoft had not bought CPM from IBM, somebody else with similar expertise and attitudes probably would have. Minnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-5770870946204797072013-03-17T13:20:53.191-04:002013-03-17T13:20:53.191-04:00;);)Minnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-5346958045506900402013-03-17T13:19:46.749-04:002013-03-17T13:19:46.749-04:00From the Wikipedia article on von Mises:
"At...From the Wikipedia article on von Mises:<br /><br />"At the age of twelve Ludwig spoke fluent Yiddish, German, Polish, and French, read Latin, and could understand Ukrainian."<br /><br />True, he did not speak English yet, but he was no dummy as far as languages were concerned. He knew what he was saying. (Besides, English "inferior" is virtually the same in French and Latin.)Minnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-89723483841704886572013-03-17T11:14:53.338-04:002013-03-17T11:14:53.338-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.John L. Davidson, Esq., Saint Louis, Missourihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06489381481280010964noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-91485252711642934732013-03-16T21:36:17.993-04:002013-03-16T21:36:17.993-04:00With today's technology, you can now access fr...With today's technology, you can now access free audio book downloads. I found this service very helpful when my internet connection at home was being repaired for over a week. You don't have to list the books <br />on an online auction site and wait to see if someone buys it or <br />not.<br /><br />My page - <a href="http://learnholyislam.org/read_blog/377367/the-latest-on-uncomplicated-plans-of-good-book" rel="nofollow">learnholyislam.org</a>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-74695425007281072692013-03-16T18:01:17.105-04:002013-03-16T18:01:17.105-04:00Continued....
Asking "where do geniuses come...Continued....<br /><br />Asking "where do geniuses come from", brings up the obvious problem with this line of thought. Mises says somewhere that the cause of the improvement in the living standards of the masses are two relatively small groups, he names entrepreneurs and "technical experts", as far as I can remember. There are three problems here.... Firstly, we could all name other groups that are important too, though that doesn't change the principle much. Secondly, in some cases the Determinists are probably right, and if person X didn't exist then person Y would have taken their place, roughly speaking.<br /><br />Lastly, even to the extent that Mises is right, those important people often come from the masses themselves. Mises is labelling them differently because of what they've done. Mises doesn't talk about this mostly because it's tangential to his point. He's not saying "yah, boo, sucks, common man, you're inferior", he's not saying they're stupid (uncreative maybe), he points out that they aren't in dozens of places in his books. He's not arguing for giving up on Democracy. We can all agree on the limitations of ordinary voters (in which I'd include myself), without thinking that Autocracy or Aristocracy would be superior. Other types of government don't really depend on merit. Whoever the government are they have to do what the masses want for important decisions or risk revolution anyway. The point Mises wants to draw out is that exceptional people must be free to act so that they can contribute. In one of his books he gives as an example the better standard of retail stores enjoyed by Americans compared to Europeans. He points out that it's doubtful that Americans are better workers, and America may not have better entrepreneurs. The difference in his opinion was the regulations which limited how businesses operated in Europe (limitations on chain stores for example).Currenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645195276844244481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-49364323898698719062013-03-16T18:00:40.821-04:002013-03-16T18:00:40.821-04:00"However, to the extent that I am talented in..."However, to the extent that I am talented in this sense, if I ever talk about people who are to the left of me on a given skills distribution where I excel (remember, there are many distributions) as 'inferior' people, somebody please take me aside, give me a good walloping, and talk some sense into me."<br /><br />It's not very polite certainly, I would never say it. But, is it actually wrong? Mises says similar things in more acceptable ways in his books.<br /><br />I think what Mises is talking about isn't so much about skills distributions within specific fields. What he's thinking about is overall contribution to society. Some people contribute vastly more than others. Some of that is luck. Inherited wealth and opportunities play a huge part too. As Daniel says, people are not born with equal ability.<br /><br />Anyway, however talents are acquired the fact remains that some people contribute far more than others. Social Determinists may say that if Napolean (for example) hadn't being born then someone else would have served in his place and history would have been similar. That argument is very difficult to make in modern market economies though. We live in a world where very many people can start businesses in their garages, and many do. Only a few of them succeed though. Suppose that Elon Musk hadn't being born, does that mean that someone else (or many people) would have done the things he did? It's not likely because taking the case where he exists we would expect to see those people doing the same things anyway. But, we don't see many Paypals, many electric car companies or many space companies. Of course, a good deal of success in business can be luck, I'm not denying that but we can't write it all off that way.<br /><br />Taking contribution to society as a benchmark, none of us want to think of ourselves as "inferior". Rand and Mises would be the first to say that thinking that way isn't good for personal development. But we have to admit that there is a "spectrum" of contributions, which is just putting things more politely. We have to put this fact to ourselves politely. To do otherwise is just to deny reality to make ourselves feel better.<br />Currenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645195276844244481noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-55580451269733872882013-03-16T17:38:30.001-04:002013-03-16T17:38:30.001-04:00+ 1+ 1Unlearningeconhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13687413107325575532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-73934148577689506822013-03-16T17:16:44.731-04:002013-03-16T17:16:44.731-04:00Obviously, Mises and Rand fell into the 'infer...Obviously, Mises and Rand fell into the 'inferior' category. Lordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06747994571555237739noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-85224144103193174172013-03-16T15:11:43.157-04:002013-03-16T15:11:43.157-04:00Rand probably was, yeah. As well as a horrible wri...Rand probably was, yeah. As well as a horrible writer.Koenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14226133743749804429noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-2860491127525924092013-03-16T14:31:36.696-04:002013-03-16T14:31:36.696-04:00It's a horrific comment and Current just resta...It's a horrific comment and Current just restated it in slightly more amicable terms.<br /><br />But it seems to me Mises was simply trying to make an ally of Rand, who herself was actually that malicious.Unlearningeconhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13687413107325575532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1740670447258719504.post-58100511788914728092013-03-16T12:27:07.946-04:002013-03-16T12:27:07.946-04:00Dk wrote: "However, to the extent that I am t...Dk wrote: "However, to the extent that I am talented in this sense, if I ever talk about people who are to the left of me on a given skills distribution where I excel (remember, there are many distributions) as "inferior" people, somebody please take me aside, give me a good walloping, and talk some sense into me."<br /><br />yes, I agree this is problematic. But it need not be indicative of malicious feelings on Mises's part. it could also simply be a result of English not being his native language or a just a crudely, hastily worded comment. Unless there are other parts of Mises's work that also seem to indicate some similar less than wholesome feelings I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt here.Koenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14226133743749804429noreply@blogger.com